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Curiosity

 
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CRACKED



Joined: 12 Jun 2013
Posts: 134
Location: Lowestoft, Suffolk

PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 5:15 pm    Post subject: Curiosity Reply with quote

Bob I hope you don't mind me doing it this way.
This is about the locomotive shown on your site

https://playingtrains.wordpress.com/2016/08/17/curiosity/


I think the loco is an old German Trix model. In this country the system was known as trix twin and was designed to allow two trains to be independently controlled. The centre rail was common to both. The Chassis was live to the centre rail. This was to prevent shorts when two locomotives were coupled.

Very early locomotives (first year of production) had the chassis live to the rail collectors. It was found owners were having problems as they were using controllers from a single wired transformer (to save money). Originally separately wound transformers for each controller were specified.


If you do not want to go for DCC, another option would be to go for stud contact instead of the third rail. One problem with trying to use the fell system for current collection is that it did not continue over turnouts.
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Blackcloud Railways



Joined: 25 Oct 2006
Posts: 1991
Location: Sandbach UK

PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Clive (and Giles via PM), I didn't recognise it as Trix Twin. I'm thinking about using an old Tri-ang chassis with a scratch built box-cab body on it as the banker and saw the third rail as an easier way of making the loco operate independently, not at all unlike the Trix Twin system, the other option was to string up a trolley wire and put a bow collector on the roof.

The Fell rail would run from the right hand traverser fiddleyard (Estacion Centrales) to just short of Rio Paleta where the banker would either return light engine or wait on the main line to attach on the front of the next down train, so it wouldn't cross any points.

DCC? Me?? I think not. Wink
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giles b



Joined: 25 Oct 2006
Posts: 2005
Location: London

PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2016 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Regarding the maker of your mystery loco, Bob, I'd begun to wonder if it is by Trix, as it appears to have a motor rather different to what I remember of them (admittedly clouded by the passage of the better part of sixty years). In particular I can't see the reversing switch which should be visible in the cab. I've just done something I should have thought about before, and enlarged the view from below the chassis - the maker turns out to be Lehmann (which also explains the unfamiliar coupling) although the country of origin is too rubbed to be certain it says Germany. Did Lehmann make early Trix models? Someone on here is sure to know.

How are you planning to approach a possible Fell loco? Conversion of a loco with this type of wiring, or fitting skates to a conventional DC loco? I suppose you'd only need to fit a central skate to replace the wipers on the insulated wheels, and still be able to use the "live" wheels to create a loco independent of the main controller. Driving a double-headed train on two controllers would be fun!
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Blackcloud Railways



Joined: 25 Oct 2006
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Location: Sandbach UK

PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2016 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That makes sense Giles, Lehmann (as in LGB garden railways) use rail skates for improved contact.

Yes, a single central skate would do the job. I like the idea of the skate also acting as a rail cleaner though and would probably add a non-functional skate over the opposite rail too. There is some steel track at the Centrales end of the layout so regular "skating" would be an advantage.

Double heading (downhill) and banking (uphill) using two controllers would indeed be a challenge... But it would also be fun... And that's what the hobby is about! Wink

I'm thinking that if the assisting engine is not attached to the train it will be able to drop off at the top of the incline while the train carries on through Rio Paleta without stopping but, obviously, downhill trains would need more care. The train would be brought to a stand short of the waiting light engine which would then buffer up to the train engine before both proceed together down the incline.

There are only three sidings on the scenic section of FCPyF (one each at Rio, Centrales and Resurreccion) so there's not much opportunity for shunting. This was never a problem when the modules were used at exhibitions because we ran an intensive service of through trains on the main line to keep the audience entertained and shunting caused most of the layout to stand idle while the line was blocked. However, for home use such standstills are not an issue as there's only me watching and the service is nowhere near as intensive as it was at shows.

Sometimes there's just one train a day, or even no trains for a couple of days.

I would like to add a bit more operational, rather than viewing, interest though and I see the banker as being a good way of doing this.
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giles b



Joined: 25 Oct 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2016 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Apologies. Accidental double post

Last edited by giles b on Thu Aug 18, 2016 9:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
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giles b



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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2016 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="giles b"]
Blackcloud Railways wrote:
Double heading (downhill) and banking (uphill) using two controllers would indeed be a challenge...


Just like the prototype, in fact, with good timing and co-operation needed from the two drivers. The video should be interesting Twisted Evil Wink
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Blackcloud Railways



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PostPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2016 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Slight change of plan, I've just bought an HO scale pantograph on a well known auction site. The banker will be a juicebox collecting power from a trolley wire. I reckon an electric loco would probably be able to tackle the grade without the assistance of a Fell rail. Using overhead wires will still enable the assisting engine to be controlled independently but I'll be able to back it into the siding at Rio Paleta allowing other trains to pass.

Design wise I'm looking at something similar in shape and size to the locos ordered by the Portmadoc, Beddgelert and South Snowdon Railway. They're not pretty, but I really do like vintage electric locos.
http://www.16mm.org.uk/newsite/motm/mom2012-08.html

I'm not intending to copy the Peebles locos exactly, the FCPyF's machines will have been built to different specifications, 2'6" gauge with 1500vDC electrification and planked instead of panelled bodywork (to simplify construction by allowing the use of coffee stirrer cladding over a card shell).
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CRACKED



Joined: 12 Jun 2013
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Location: Lowestoft, Suffolk

PostPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2016 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It might end up looking something like these German Electrics.
These were actually converted freight wagons.


https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/LAG_Nr._891

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/LAG_Nr._895

http://www.wiwi.uni-frankfurt.de/~rainerh/diss/pfdvde09.jpg
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Blackcloud Railways



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PostPosted: Sat Sep 03, 2016 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bu%%er! The pan has arrived and a very nice piece of kit it is too. Unfortunately its springs are not strong enough to make it hold against an overhead wire. It can be posed but will not collect current because any contact with the wire will simply push it down at a low spot and the connection will be broken as soon as the train moves away from a stanchion and the wire becomes free to move upwards.

It will not be wasted, I think one of my Gn15 critters could become a sparky but using a dummy overhead wire instead of actually collecting current properly.

So, it's back to plan A for the banker with a Fell brake and traction rail acting as third rail electrical contact.
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